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Post by akirkaldy on May 13, 2003 14:26:25 GMT
How many of you can see the line on the left hand kerb of the Chicane while approaching it at race speed?
Also is it possible for you to corect your line by the time you have noticed it to not cross it?
All the Zetec Drivers were pulled in under red flags at the F3 meeting to get a warning for ALL of us crossing this! NO ONE was gaining an advantage due to us all crossing it but still we lost 6 minutes in quilifying to be told off for it!
Does anyone agree that for arguement sake we measure a Legend (cause its so narrow) from left hand wheel outside edge to inside edge of the left hand wheel and put the bollard this distance from the white line on the Right hand apex kerb, This way no one can cross it and we also have a point to head for knowing we are not going to cross the line cannot see!
Whats your thoughts??
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Post by historicracer on May 13, 2003 16:31:01 GMT
Yellow flags I cant c why they are getting their knickers in a twist so much about the kerb hopping when they should be watching out for real dangerous driving in each of the last 3 meetings iv been overtaken under the yellow flags including at the weekend when u could clearly see a marshall at the side of the track waving to us to slow down which me and 2 infrotn did only to be nailed into the corner by someone taking advantage. That is far far more dangerous than cutting a few curbs and though the marshals are great and do an unsung job i think the observers should be watching what is going on on the track not watching whos on the white lines ps. in the legend we tend to drive on anything that aint green cheers lance  |
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Post by JamesHerriot on May 13, 2003 17:12:42 GMT
Yeh but what this is really all about is the SMRC having a go at F/FORDS, they don`t seem to harass the xr2s or legends or the minis for the same issues or am i wrong ?
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Post by JapaneseElvis on May 13, 2003 19:12:21 GMT
The days of saying that you can't criticise officials because they are volunteers should surely be over now.
People are spending many thousands of pounds and huge commitment on their motor racing, only to be faced with this sort of bureaucratic pants.
Whilst I don't necessarily agree that you should have to have raced cars to hold high office, I do believe that you should have a rough idea of whats going on (e.g. rain falling continuosly & wet track = wet race) and listen to drivers concerns.
People should be pulling together for the greater good of motor racing in Scotland.
So there.
And another thing, what will they all wear if the Harris Tweed industry goes down the pan?
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Post by RocketRacer on May 13, 2003 19:20:53 GMT
How many of you can see the line on the left hand kerb of the Chicane while approaching it at race speed? Does anyone agree that for arguement sake we measure a Legend (cause its so narrow) from left hand wheel outside edge to inside edge of the left hand wheel and put the bollard this distance from the white line on the Right hand apex kerb, This way no one can cross it Well even in a Legend you can't see the white line at race speed, you have to take a guess and hope the flags not waiting on you at the start line sometimes and i agree if your over it and know it just before hand a legend driver can't fix it either ! As for the arguement sake if you really want the bollard so tight to the track that's something you would have to look into first , Because the distance from the track to the bollard would be about 50 inches ( max wheel width of legend is 60 " and the trye width is about 9-10" so 60" - 10" = 50" which is 4 feet) not much room for error i'd say . the answer from the SMRC is to race on the track not off it, but as a legends racer i know that is harder to do than say . so i think it has to be a compromise between the drivers and the SMRC so i think we need to stick together on this. |
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Post by Racemania on May 13, 2003 20:29:17 GMT
Wouldn't get too bothered about it if its the F3 meeting the problem was. I overheard some of the BRDC Officials talking about us Support Race Drivers they were criticising how laid back we all were and we lacked the professionalism they were use to. w**kers the lot of them, still we have to throll them if we want to see the F3's and GT's at Knockhill. I went for my licence after the last race only to be given a lecture on when I could retrieve it.... 30mins after the Results are published if there is no appeal. Went back 20 mins later and they relented, it seems unlike south of the border they hadn't received any appeals.... So Lance ...they were waiting for you to pay your money  and appeal these Yellow Flag infringements otherwise they will do nothing  . By the way Lance glad to see I'm not the only person to gets passed under yellow flags! Our eficient Clerk of Course did refer to me as Mr, unfortunately if he was hoping for a Thank you Sir in reply he only got Ta.See ya. |
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Post by Blair on May 13, 2003 21:00:28 GMT
This seems really s*** all this crap you're all getting from the C.o.C...  I dunno, I wouldn't put up with it. Would it be appropriate for someone to draft a letter and get all the drivers who aren't happy to sign it and present it to Nick Clark? |
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Post by Blair on May 13, 2003 21:03:09 GMT
Wouldn't get too bothered about it if its the F3 meeting the problem was. I overheard some of the BRDC Officials talking about us Support Race Drivers they were criticising how laid back we all were and we lacked the professionalism they were use to. w**kers the lot of them, still we have to throll them if we want to see the F3's and GT's at Knockhill. Isn't that the whole point - you're all meant to be laid back and enjoying yourselves this aint F1 lol... |
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NeilS
Backmarker
Posts: 35
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Post by NeilS on May 13, 2003 21:45:22 GMT
Interesting that about overtaking under yellows, as there was a fair bit of that in the GT race at the hairpin, anybody else notice it?
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Post by Catriona on May 14, 2003 0:10:55 GMT
The F3 drivers weren't exactly taking it easy under yellow, either... seems the organisation as a whole wasn't the best on Sunday :S
Btw, is is just me, or have I heard similar things about cutting corners at the chicane before now? Might've been BTCC a few years back or something, but I rather think this is far from the first time drivers have had a different opinion to officials on what's allowed there... seems to me the officials need to relax a bit more, or at the very least actually go out there in a racing car (preferably a nice low Formula Ford) and see if they can find the white line any better than all the drivers they keep blackflagging for it :dozey:
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Post by JamesHerriot on May 14, 2003 0:22:03 GMT
I`m with KF , lets just take him out the back & shoot him !
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Post by NS-R on May 14, 2003 7:50:01 GMT
JH - no, they give us the same amount of grief in the Xr's as well... Iain Cowie was excluded from a race last year for crossing the white lines through the chicane. He explained that you cannot see the line in a Caterham so the FF boys haven't got a chance... All the Caterhams were doing it yet only Iain got excluded - no consistency and it nearl ycost him the championship... Like you say, if drivers consider the conditions to be too dangerous, surely the official should take note. I'm still not happy about what happenend in the last XR2 race where it should have been red flagged (since I was sat in the middle of the track on the exit of Clarks and there weren't even any yellow flags!) Maybe they'll think about it when one of us ends up in hospital... Nick www.ns-r.co.uk |
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Post by Dave on May 14, 2003 9:11:23 GMT
As far as im aware its the white line at the chicane and drivers putting all 4s over the white line at Clarks! They've tried everything starting with a cone to a plastic marker and now a tyre wall which is quite dangerous in my opinion! Go straight into that about 50 and see what the damage is!  If you all went and studied the corner and found a point to aim for each lap you could make a effort to avoid the white line but during a race that goes out the window due to pressures and the time saving. Dave. |
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NeilS
Backmarker
Posts: 35
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Post by NeilS on May 14, 2003 11:24:09 GMT
Ok, so we've to stay on the track. I'm sure we all realise that, but don't know about anyone else but Clarks is my least favorite corner, get your line right and its fine but slightly wrong or entry speed just a bit too much and your over the line, and it's such a crucial one leading onto the fasted part of the track. Admit thats one I could do with some lessons on  |
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Post by Big Bad Wedgie on May 14, 2003 13:40:13 GMT
Guys,
I have been reading this thread and other associated ones and would like to offer my take, as a flag marshal for the last 8 years, on the topics.
Corner cutting.
As far as I can tell tracks are never wide enough for the drivers and, no matter how often the circuit is widened, drivers will try to gain as much advantage as they can. The organising club/officials have to take a stand at some point. This is as much to do with driver safety as anything else.
Case in point, I flagged at Clark/Railway for the first two meetings this year and the Mini's were a joke. You were lucky if, on EVERY lap, more than a quarter of the cars were between the white lines coming out of Clark. A large number were regularly beyond the grasscrete. This led to the track resembling a gravel rally stage and required alot of clearing up before the next practice/race. Thankfully their qualifying was red flagged and they were given a good talking to and things have improved a little since.
As Dave said "They've tried everything starting with a cone to a plastic marker and now a tyre wall which is quite dangerous in my opinion!" So the organiser's have tried to stop this happening (cone to a plastic marker) and some drivers have ignored it resulting in the draconian/"dangerous" tyre wall. I have to say I was surprised to see the tyre wall still in place for the F3/GT meeting.
The marshals at Chicane used to take bets on who the nominated driver was, in each class, whos job it was to take out the plastic markers during practice.
"Wet/Dry Race"
NSR - "Like you say, if drivers consider the conditions to be too dangerous, surely the official should take note."
Sorry, but if a driver considers the conditions to dangerous, why is it up to officials to tell them not to go out? If all the drivers considered the conditions to dangerous for slicks then they could have all gone back to the pits to change tyres and left the organisers with egg on their faces.
Also NSR "I'm still not happy about what happened in the last XR2 race where it should have been red flagged (since I was sat in the middle of the track on the exit of Clarks and there weren't even any yellow flags!)"
Yes, the race should have been red flagged. As far as I know there was a problem with radio communications during the incident and the Incident Officer on Railway(post 6) was livid that the red flag was not shown.
"since I was sat in the middle of the track on the exit of Clarks and there weren't even any yellow flags!" - Sorry but there was a yellow flag being waved at Clark, I should know because I was waving it. Because of the layout of the spectator bank on the outside of the exit of Clark, all I could see of your car was the roof and I heard the commentator say that your car was on the track pointing the wrong way therefore I waved the yellow flag.
KJR
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